Information Minister Shabery Cheek has denied making personal attacks on Anwar Ibrahim in the televised debate.
Replying to critics, he said he had not taken pot shots at Anwar:
"I only criticized his policy stance during the 1997 financial crisis when he was the deputy prime minister. I talked about his policies and leadership record when questioning his credibility to strengthen my arguments.
“I just wanted to strengthen my argument," Shabery said (ref: TheStar)
"Personal attacks will be more about criticizing his face, his clothes or his preferences," Shabery said at the Parliament lobby yesterday.
Hahaha... today I learn one thing: Personal attacks is about criticizing face, clothes and preferences!!! That's something profound to me!
Now, I can criticize anybody on anything and so long as I don't criticize their face, clothes and preferences on food or clothings.
Shabery said he was satisfied with his performance as he had managed to erase the myth of Anwar being a great orator. He also said he had received hundreds of SMSes congratulating him on his performance at the debate.
And he is going to meet the Prime Minister to evaluate his performance and probably see whether he will get a promotion or recognition.
Asked whether there should be more of such debates, Ahmad Shabery said "It is better than having street demonstrations or inappropriate concerts."
He hoped that it would be an institutionalized part of Malaysian politics in the future.
Source: NST: 'I questioned his policies, not his clothes'
Replying to critics, he said he had not taken pot shots at Anwar:
"I only criticized his policy stance during the 1997 financial crisis when he was the deputy prime minister. I talked about his policies and leadership record when questioning his credibility to strengthen my arguments.
“I just wanted to strengthen my argument," Shabery said (ref: TheStar)
"Personal attacks will be more about criticizing his face, his clothes or his preferences," Shabery said at the Parliament lobby yesterday.
Hahaha... today I learn one thing: Personal attacks is about criticizing face, clothes and preferences!!! That's something profound to me!
Now, I can criticize anybody on anything and so long as I don't criticize their face, clothes and preferences on food or clothings.
Shabery said he was satisfied with his performance as he had managed to erase the myth of Anwar being a great orator. He also said he had received hundreds of SMSes congratulating him on his performance at the debate.
And he is going to meet the Prime Minister to evaluate his performance and probably see whether he will get a promotion or recognition.
Asked whether there should be more of such debates, Ahmad Shabery said "It is better than having street demonstrations or inappropriate concerts."
He hoped that it would be an institutionalized part of Malaysian politics in the future.
Source: NST: 'I questioned his policies, not his clothes'
19 comments:
wow, open season for 'cheeky' monkey hunting..
yeah,Shabery's explanation on the "personal attack" is rather shallow.for sure he had to defend himself by saying that.still i congralutes him for having the balls to face Anwar eventhough imho he didn't really do well.
one thing sure,i agree that debate like that even better than street demo.no roadblocks,no traffic jam.
Pathetic, that's all I can say of Shabby Cheeky. Total hogwash.
millions of M'sian public dare to debate with any BNatang politician on any topic given the oppurtunity to be on live telecast. Any takers from KERAjaan BNatang politicians!
CHICKEN
I for one thinks he did well.
He also received angry SMSs.
And I for one also thinks what he said is correct in that what he said was not personal attacks. he may not have defined personal attack clearly but what he said during the debate were not personal attack
mave,
that was what i heard on buletin 1.30 pm yesterday!! but surely he talked more on tv lah...
He said Anwar too personally attacked him when he brought up Semangat 46. anwar has opened up a can lid. hahaha... if you guys dig his history, you'll be surprised! he was once on the street protest too!
he won't resign believe me.. he said he'll leave it to PakLah to decide (there you go.. he has no balls!). the MSM/BN see him as a hero.
he's playing the blame game when he's saying about 1997 crisis. policies wouldn't be approved in one man's hands only.
i should call him "president of history club". makes me want to know more about the truth!
Kittykat Honey,
We now can use this definition in our vocab and writings.
Azlan,
You have a good point.
Francis,
But I like his definition.
Chicken,
I don't think so; not many have the courage to stand in a debate carried live on TV. For that I must praise Shabery.
Warrior2,
Well, you have defined it the same way and you must have the same vocab.
Suealeen,
Hahaha... Anwar made mention about the fact that he was a S46 member; and he called it personal attack while what he did say wasn't construed as personal attack and some commentators agreed; I'm perplexed!
"ALOR STAR: The Government will consider the people’s views before deciding whether to hold more debates with the Opposition on issues affecting the people.
Deputy Prime Minister Datuk Seri Najib Tun Razak said the Government was studying the feedback from Tuesday night’s debate between Information Minister Datuk Ahmad Shabery Cheek and PKR leader Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim.
“We want to know the people’s opinion before deciding
on future debates,” he told reporters.
Najib said the debate between Ahmad Shabery and Anwar was proof of the Government’s openness to criticism and issues affecting the people.
Home Minister Datuk Seri Syed Hamid Albar, who was also at the ceremony, said the debate was a new approach to discuss issues which affected the people.
“The people can decide if we are on the right track and if the Opposition are rhetorical in their debate to gain popularity,” he said"
so,what do you guys think?will this kind of debate gonna keep continuing soon?.for me,it's kinda healthy because the public can have a little dose of the issue concerning public matter.
found this definition of 'personal attack' at Wikipedia:
Generally, a personal attack is committed when a person substitutes abusive remarks for evidence when examining another person's claims or comments. It is considered a personal attack when a person starts referencing a supposed flaw or weakness in an individual's personality, beliefs, lifestyle, convictions or principles, and use it as a debate tactic or as a means of avoiding discussion of the relevance or truthfulness the person's statement. It works on the reasoning that, by discrediting the source of a logical argument, namely the person making it, the argument itself can be weakened. It is the referencing of a supposed flaw or weakness of an individual rather than an argument that delineates the personal attack.
This line of "reasoning" is often fallacious because the attack is directed at the person making the claim and not the claim itself. The truth value of a claim is independent of the person making the claim. No matter how morally repugnant a person might be, he or she can still make true claims. For example, a defense attorney may claim that a witness's testimony cannot be trusted because he is a convicted felon. On the other hand, illuminating real character flaws and inconsistencies in the position of an opponent are a vital part of the public political process and of the adversarial judicial process. Use of a personal attack in a logical argument constitutes an informal fallacy called ad hominem, a term that comes from a Latin phrase meaning "toward the man".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_personal_attacks
oh ... and the meaning of ad hominem:
An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: "argument to the person", "argument against the man") consists of replying to an argument or factual claim by attacking or appealing to a characteristic or belief of the person making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim. The process of proving or disproving the claims is thereby subverted, and the argumentum ad hominem works to change the subject.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
hello mave,
He is just trying to excuse himself from being accuse of giving such statements to DSAI. Dun worry. Every viewers knew what is the meaning of "personal attacks". Perhaps he underestimate us with his superior mind but the fact he is just covering his excuse with rubbish talks. HA HA.
My understanding is that anwar defined what sabry cheek said as being a personal attack. Thus sabry is using the same definition to say that.
btw, after the debate, astro rpima had a commentary session ivolving a few panelist. One of them commented on the claim of personal attack. He also said the same in that what was said, was not personal attack. I believe than, Sabry, me and that person as well as some others who thought so too has vaning the same vocab . hehe
like i said, he has nothing to lose. his guts alone will earn him a lot of points esp in UMNO. he's eyeing higher post.
in line wif his definition, i wanna make a personal attack at him. his face look like kera. oppss...
I "met" rubbery cheek once. but my gut feel was "a rat a rat" but thought (magnaminously says she) "give him the benefit of the doubt"
For a shallow person like me I give a prelim gauge of the man's worth by
- how you shake my hands (or not?)
Rubbery appraoched our table of 4 where only 1 of the 4 was a famous blogger. He proceeded to shake the famous blogger's hand, whom he did not know at that time, but ignored the other 3 of us dunggus
Now you gotta ask yourself, how long and hard is it to shake 4 hands? Wierd no?
As to can he look you in the eye?
NOT! is the answer!
So to cut to the chase..
yeah...she ain't that wrong when the stomach flips over!
Maybe Rubbery was selected by - virtue of the short straw drawn?
- or maybe because he is a more neutral choice?
- or maybe because he is a higher IQ choice ?
(given the limited candidates from their pool of limited talents)
Betul jugak tu, yang Shabery cakap tu nak tunjukkan yang pada masa dulunya macam mana cara Anwar buat keputusan. Konon2 macam pandai sangat tapi masa dia jadi menteri kewangan dulu macam bodoh je keputusan.
Shabery nak gunakan masa yang diberikan dengan secukupnya.
Dia bincangkan isu yang disoal dan dalam masa yang sama ingin meng-higlight-kan bagaimana sebenarnya Anwar bila membuat keputusan.
I am wondering why every BN Minister has this "self praise" disease... Hmmm.... do you think it is from the leader??
Well Mav,
This is the standard of Malaysian minister lah, when it's black to everyone, it's dark to them. When it's white to everyone, it's light to them. It is always interpreted to their own interest.
Everyone(more or less) feels it's personal attacks, hit below the belt or whatever you want to call it but our "INFORMATION MINISTER" informs us otherwise.
Everyone(more or less) feels that Cheeky never really stick to the debate(as compare to DSAI)but our "INFORMATION MINISTER" informs us that he did very well and so did most of the MSM(cheering away).
And if you must insist on the "he got balls..." thing, well I have to give him that but so does a gorilla......especially the foaming bit.
I don't know, I always thought that a smart/clever/intelligent/intellectual man is measured by his brain/mind, I did not know actually the size of his balls counts.
Since we have normal size balls only, no wonder we are not "INFORMATION MINISTER" or any of the Lah Lah ministers lah!
So you guys out there, train them balls and not the mind ok.
Therefore, to those who think the same lingo with Cheeky, train them balls hard, forget the books....
Sorry for the sarcarm, really TOOLAN......
Azlan,
I share your opinion and I would be glad if the govt permit such debates which is televised.
Anon 1:06pm & Anon 1:15pm,
Thanks for the definition and link.
Wsidomthinker,
Ha ha; that was a good ending statement.
Warrior2,
Ya, the commentator had profound English which was shared as a universal definition; maybe, this is Malaysian vocab which is far more authoritative which I now subscribe.
CK,
No personal attack pls; not the face, clothes or personal preferences.
Gobloking,
Gobloking,
Actually he is also a friend of mine but that's before he becomes a minister. We haven't met since.
Optional,
Ya, awak betul; betul terlampau...
Aopen,
Ya, awak betul juga.
Bunnies,
But they don't think this is self praise; it's acknowledgement...
Toolan,
I reserved my comment.
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